PBJ: The Musical - How the Developers Cooked Up This Handmade Twist on Romeo and Juliet

"If Shakespeare lived today, what would he write about?"

As of late, there has been a resurgence of games – or in the case of Grand Theft Hamlet (which I've still yet to see), a documentary-theatre experience of sorts done entirely in GTA Online – based on ancient rites written by none other than William Shakespeare. Yes, the same lad who gave the world King Lear and made entire generations of English-speaking school kids utter the famous words, "To be, or not to be..."

Britain-based The Royal Shakespeare Company is reportedly making an adaptation of Macbeth called Lili, which is played in the style of Sam Barlow's Her Story. Then there's the upcoming Hail Macbeth made by former theater director Paolo Sacerdoti, which, based on the description alone, sounds like something out of Telltale Games' playbook (read: a choice-based interactive experience).

Personally, illiterate fool that I am, I'd consider Alan Wake 2's glorious musical bit as Shakespearean as video games can be, even if it's led by leather-laden oldtimers with eyepatches and riffs instead of soliloquies and jazz hands. But that's just me, a guy who cries every time he watches La La Land.

Speaking of interactive experiences, PBJ – The Musical is an experience unlike any other. Developed by Philipp Stollenmayer, a paper artist-turned-game designer known for Song of Bloom and a series of [Insert name of food] – The Game titles, PBJ is a "badly researched" retelling of Romeo of Juliet, but with anthropomorphized ingredients singing and rolling through the screen instead. Romeo is a well-bred peanut boy. Juliet is a strawberry girl who dreams of being a big-time movie actress like Katharine Hepburn, and they both have googly eyes. Your finger is your finger and you use that to guide the not-so-tragic lovebirds by pushing them along using interactive objects Pinball style.

It's all very sweet and sticky, not to mention catchy - before you know, you'll find yourself singing "Nutty nut nuts, we got the knack" while taking a shower.

Did I mention it's all made the same way every school production of "The Sound of Music" is staged? Why yes, by doing a lot of handcrafts with scissors, vintage cookbooks and whatnot, and getting to compose tunes and have kids sing them with no help from that dastardly AI.

Not sure which is more amazing, though: the way PBJ looks and sounds – even on my ancient iPhone 7 Plus – or the fact that Lorraine Bowen (aka The Crumble Lady), Britain's Got Talent semi-finalist and the composer of the game, managed to hold the musical little devils in one place for hours and get the takes she loved without going bananas like the Lady Macbeth (spoiler: it was the good ol' bribery by biscuits and tea.)

Which, I guess, brings us to this interview. Reader, I normally don't play mobile games, unless it's the entirely forgotten Blek or Sword & Sworcery EP. But PBJ made me stop in my tracks and reach out to the digital chef responsible for this virtual, googly-eyed delight. How else do we do such underappreciated indie gems justice, if not by bringing them the attention they deserve? Or, as the OG Wordsmith himself would say: "If music be the food of love, play on."

(Big shoutout to Edge magazine for giving a spotlight to hand-crafted games like PBJ - The Musical every single month. Now, go read the interview and don't forget to support Philipp & Lorraine by buying the game, which will cost you no more than two bags of crisps.)

SUPERJUMP

First things first – congratulations to both of you for making such a neat little game! Not only does it sound amazing, but the writing is on another level, too. Would you mind telling us how PBJ – The Musical started?

Philipp Stollenmayer (Creative Director, Kamibox)

The initial idea was to make a musical out of a strip of bacon. But Lorraine didn't like the bacon idea, which I can totally understand. Thinking a bit further about that, it would've been a bit one-dimensional. If you want to write 10 acts about bacon, it would have a pretty steep curve of tension and grease [laughs]. When we have two characters, we can just do a bit more story-wise.

Then the idea of peanut butter and jelly came up, which sounded innocent at first. Finding parallels to Shakespeare was quite easy then. So the writing was done by Shakespeare, we just took it into the 21st century.

SUPERJUMP

To do a Shakespearean twist on peanut butter and jelly, who could have thought of that? So yeah, kudos to you, guys. But going back a bit, how did you come up with the idea? I read somewhere that the spark came when you saw Lorraine's performance on Britain’s Got Talent. Is that correct?

Philipp

Yeah. Lorraine, what year was the performance?

Lorraine Bowen (Composer/Singer)

2015.

Philipp

Oh, 2015. So when I think back to around 2015, I believe I had just one game about food, which was Pancake – The Game, where you just flip a pancake and the pancake just wobbles around a bit. But Bacon – The Game, for example, was from 2018. So that was much later.

When I saw Lorraine on TV, it was more or less only the kind of humor and quirkiness that just resonated with how I designed my games. So an initial idea [for PBJ] wasn’t there yet. And I think I wrote you in 2020, so that was also five years after Britain’s Got Talent?

Lorraine

Yeah. So I got this message saying, ‘Would you like to write a musical?’, which is quite a funny message to get because I've been approached by a lot of schoolboys. I know it sounds a bit strange [laughs]. But since Britain's Got Talent, I've been flooded with wonderful comments. Never got a single bad comment from anyone. Anyway, I get a lot of schoolboys asking me to do this, that and the other. And I was just on the point of [replying], ‘Please could you get your teacher to inform me of the project, and then I can say whether I’d like to do it or not.’

But then in the second email he said that he'd won the Apple Design Award in 2020. So it’s a wonderful story of just being on the point of being slapped in the face, I think. It was a ridiculous request because I'd never done anything like that, and certainly may never get the opportunity to do anything like that again.

SUPERJUMP

So Philip first pitched you the Bacon idea, right?

Lorraine

Yes. But I'm vehemently anti-pigs standard. So I simply couldn't... He doesn't want me to speak about this, I think.

SUPERJUMP

Oh, okay. Phil, would it be cool for Lorraine to answer that?

Philipp

I wasn't aware of me restricting something. It wasn’t my intention. [laughs]

Lorraine

No, no! It's just that I can see the look of horror on your face. [laughs]

Philipp

No, no, it’s really not. It’s just that provocative thing that I was doing with Bacon – The Game. As soon as you play three levels, you see that it's totally ironic. It's a parody. So I didn't mean this as a recipe collection of bacon recipes.

Lorraine

See, the great thing about meeting Philipp and working with him is that we both have the same kind of horror, a kind of nicety and a horror at the same time. Because I've written a song about burgers, and what goes into a burger. Tongues, tongues, tongues and testicles. [singing] You know, just get it out, say it how it is. And Phil has the same kind of warped mind as mine, I think.

SUPERJUMP

Lorraine, let’s go into the actual songwriting and recording. Because this is a huge part of the production. Do you remember how long the whole process of recording and writing took you?

Lorraine

The writing officially was 10 months, and it was incredibly intense. [It was] during Covid and just being a composer – which was very exciting - it was basically kind of 24/7 for 10 months. I would wake up in the night and think of tunes. And I had a pad by my bedside. Sometimes it was rubbish in the morning... but, you know, you have to write it all the time. When melodies come in, they come in and then they go out. I always remember Oasis saying that when they come in, it's up to you – are you gonna make the opportunity of these things or are they just gonna pass you by?

How the characters started was that I would think of a friend/colleague and pass them by Philipp, 'cause everything was done collaboratively. I’d think of a friend that would be good for the character and we'd audition them. And then I would find their pitch range. I have to audition them for la la la, la, la, la la, la [singing], how high or low they could sing. Because you want to be able to create tension with the pitch. You have to write for that very particular person. It's not for any person. And you find their quirks and their eccentricities.

I was looking at the storyboards, which Philipp gave me, and each storyboard was timed out. So there's an introduction for say, four or five seconds, then verse one. And he'd say about 20 seconds to 40 seconds. And I would create this song, which wasn't a song in the end. It was a very unique thing that I'd never done before. A song normally goes from the beginning to the end. And this was kind of, I dunno how to say it really... It was a section of songs but they all had to fit into each other. And there were these things called buffers. It’s [kind of] part of the song, but it was like an instrumental solo that could come in and be fast, be about eight bars long, so that when the player would be slow at work in the game, it would repeat itself.

SUPERJUMP

So kind of like a filler?

Lorraine

Yeah. That's a good way to put it.

SUPERJUMP

And did this process require a lot of trial and error?

Lorraine

I will say that it was incredibly hard work with these people. You have to train them up. You've thought of the tune and then you have to train them to sing that tune and direct them as well. So that was a part of my work.

Then to record them as well, and to keep them happy, feed them biscuits and tea. Then obviously slot them in with the music by that time. And then it all had to be mixed and mastered. So it's a huge process. No one could ever know how long all that takes. It's like Philip's work, I imagine.

SUPERJUMP

So you had the role of a director, a casting person, a composer - a lot of different hats. You also sang, right?

Lorraine

I was the mother character, yes. And, well, I'm used to all this. This is the funny thing because when I look at credits on TV programs now, I see casting, directing, singing teacher, you know – it goes on like that. And I was thinking, ‘Gosh, I did everything!’ [Laughs] But that's what it is. It's... what would you say, Philip? An indie game?

Philipp

It definitely has the indie spirit.

SUPERJUMP

And do you guys remember what was the first song you recorded?

Lorraine

Oh, I just started from the beginning. I think you had to start from the beginning because everything comes from that tune. [starts humming “When I Grow Up”] I could go into a thesis for a degree student about [this]. [laughs]

SUPERJUMP

It's very catchy, I'm still humming it sometimes when walking to the store. Philip, do you remember what your reaction was the first time you received the original recording of “When I Grow Up”?

Philipp

I had a very strict idea in mind that the song would have to follow because of these buffers. Different people have different paces and use different times to get through the level. So we had to have these buffer sections, and we had to separate the voice track from the instrumental track.

Then there were a few surprises. For example, the voice track now goes from bar four to bar five. And in my mind, it starts at four and it ends at five. But it doesn't start at four – it starts at 3.99 because the singer makes [inhale sound] there before he starts singing. And this really changed a lot. This is much more complicated than it sounds. And the same goes for the end because I have to know this 0.01 second before that if I want to start the whole bar before I started.

SUPERJUMP

Wow. And this was your first time working with a dynamic soundtrack, right?

Philipp

Yes. The only game I had a soundtrack written for was Song of Bloom, but it was a bit easier. It was just something that could loop. Not something that really interacted with the game.

SUPERJUMP

What would you say was the most challenging part in pulling together everything from a gameplay perspective?

Philipp

The gameplay really took the longest time. I had so much focus on the visuals at the beginning. I wanted it to look like a perfect stop-motion animation. And then I thought, ‘Okay, I’ll just do the gameplay afterwards.’ But this raised so many challenges. Stop-motion animation has only 10 or 12 frames per second. But smooth gameplay – doesn't. It has to have more than 10 or 12 frames per second. So the main character now draws an invisible blob around it, and inside that blob, things move faster. You, as the player, usually don't notice that. But the edge of the screen is still animating very slowly.

The other thing that was very challenging is that it looks very realistic, but it has to feel like a fragile paper. And it doesn't feel like fragile paper when you can drag it and push it; imitating that push and transferring it in your mind in this fragile paper atmosphere was really something that didn't go together at the beginning. I had to do many tests [in order to] make people understand what is touchable and what’s not. Because everything was so colorful, I couldn't make the touch points more visual because it's already very, very expensive in terms of where you can look. This was very experimental. In the end, I ended up with the player just tapping anywhere and the world reacts somehow.

SUPERJUMP

In the press kit, you mentioned that you discarded some previous iterations of PBJ before settling on the current version. Do you remember what prompted those changes and how this trial-and-error approach helped you reach the version you were happy with?

Philipp

Yes, it changed very much. In the beginning, I had a very early prototype [of PBJ] that felt more like Bacon – The Game. You could just tap, and something would throw. It was only a piece of toast in the first version [that] would throw through all the levels and fly and make stuff. And when I got more visual, I wanted to have everything at one spot so that the eye is overloaded and that the mind just is flooded with visual impressions. And then I played it: I [realized] this harms the gameplay because you don't have the space if you are toast or you’re a strawberry so that you could fly a long way – it always found some object to collide with. So I had to change the design to free more space.

And I also had objects that you couldn't collide with but had to react with visually. So these objects are in the background color, for example. And the shapes of things that are cut out from paper are very irregular. And that is also why I use very big scissors to cut it out, to artificially get this handmade feeling. And that is something that is harder to control than just straight lines and easy shapes. And that is something that I just learned too late and had to do so many tests.

SUPERJUMP

Did the design of levels require a lot of reconstructing then? Because you have to guide the player in the direction they have to move.

Philipp

Absolutely. This is something that I found out quite early. When the curtains open and you see how the strawberry is there between these fingers, and you have to drag the finger, that strawberry falls out, it isn't clear to the player what's actually the goal here because it looks like a movie. You would expect just from the look that it just happens automatically. I had many iterations where I added more and more clues and more help. The first thing is that the gravity changes when you're too long in one spot. If you are on a flat surface and taking too long, then the surface tilts toward the goal.

The second thing is the obvious one, and that is the guiding star. [It] comes up if you are not touching the screen or touching something too far away from the character, and helps you through the level.

And the third thing is very subtle. It is a secret [invisible] image that lies over the whole scene that tilts the strawberry or the peanut in the right direction, depending on where you're lying on an edge.

SUPERJUMP

Wow, that’s clever.

Lorraine

Ignas, do you think that PBJ – The Musical could be incredibly important for the next three years as AI kind of slightly swallows up [the industry]?

SUPERJUMP

Definitely.

Lorraine

PBJ – The Musical could be an example of a rejection of that.

SUPERJUMP

Exactly. I once even wrote an article on this game called Harold Halibut. You might be aware of it, Phil.

Philipp

Yeah. We were actually nominated in the same category for the German computer prize for the best graphic design. And this is why I think we can't win that because Harold Halibut has perfect visuals.

SUPERJUMP

Lorraine, do you know Wallace and Gromit?

Lorraine

Yes.

SUPERJUMP

So the design team, they made all their scenes and animation in the style of Wallace and Gromit. Which was never done before to that extent. And they spent around 10 years making the game.

Lorraine

But if they've got a team, then that has to be put into consideration. There's only two people here!

SUPERJUMP

You guys should definitely get a separate category for design.

Lorraine

But do you see it almost as a rejection, Philipp? I mean, it's so much part of your life and your history, the paper, that it's your soul, isn't it?

Philipp

Before I did something, or before I did anything digital, I always made paper crafts. Because I was fascinated by things coming flat out of the printer, you can transfer it over the internet and then you can do something that even moves or that you can put anywhere. I even did a 3D clone of myself in the original scale, all from paperwork.

SUPERJUMP

Would you mind sharing how long you have been doing paper art? Did the idea to make a cutout-style game come to you from your passion?

Philipp

Do you know Song of Bloom, my earlier game?

SUPERJUMP

Yes!

Philipp

So Song of Bloom also had a few sections where I had cut things out of paper. And I just love how well the digital thing and the analog thing goes together. Straightaway, you have this kind of warmth that goes with cutting it out and getting it into the digital area. And this is just something that I wanted to do and everything that came after – I just ignored in step one. This is how it started and this is how it ended.

SUPERJUMP

That's a beautiful line, Philipp. “This is how it started and this is how it ended.”

Lorraine

It sounds almost like a song. This is how it started and this is how it ended. [singing]

SUPERJUMP

How much printing and scanning was involved in making of your game, then?

Philipp

I didn't actually scan it because if I scanned it [normally], the shadows would have been flat. I placed it on these very low-contrast mats. When I photograph something on it, it doesn't have any reflections or any paper structure beneath it. That's why I buy these things.

Then I cut it out in Photoshop, and I think this was the main work. I had done maybe 500 or so figures, tracing them all. You could have thought that cutting out everything was my main work, but it wasn't – it was cutting it out and Photoshop, that was much more intense [work] than cutting the actual things.

SUPERJUMP

How many hours do you think it took you in total to cut out everything and prepare stuff in Photoshop and Unity?

Philipp

If I did everything from day in and day out (and night), maybe around two months in total. Cutting it all out in Photoshop was a lot of work, but at least it was also very rewarding because you could see your progress. There were no false ways – every click that I made led to the target or led to the goal.

And this was not the same with the gameplay. If I changed something in the gameplay, I would have to test that. And then I’d learn it doesn't work and then I have to restart that... So that was a different kind of work.

SUPERJUMP

Lorraine, I read that you convinced Philip to sing along in some of the chorus. Is that true?

Lorraine

Yes! Philip is such a star for doing that because I think Harold Halibut or whatever his name is, they haven't got that; I think game developers should become a star, a glamorous star. And I think Philipp is ripe and ready for that role. Developers now have to walk on the red carpet of the Oscars.

Philip, he's just amazing. Because he rose to the challenge, just as I rose to the challenge of doing this crazy music. And yeah, it took a few times, but we got him to do the credits at the end, which is beautiful. He's also one of the chefs in Act 7. He did some humming. [starts humming] Which is as lovely as it's beautiful. These are all really tiny little things. But for me, I hear all of them. I just hope other people will hear it too.

SUPERJUMP

Before we go back to Philipp, I want to ask if, taking into consideration that all of the songs you had to compose had to be dynamic and full of buffers, this changed your approach to songwriting?

Lorraine

Absolutely. Because, what you realize very soon is that the verse or the words can be taken almost out of context with the next part. Also, a musical is a really wonderful genre because there are many thoughts put into composition. Is this a commentary on what's happening or is it driving the drama forward? Is it something that will change from the beginning to the end due to music?

For example, we're having a surprise party, which is just a lovely ride through the party. And I put the trumpet player in the background, so when you are opening the door, you’re hearing the trumpet. It's got a band of live musicians, and it feels very alive. It's got gate crashes that are coming in and going. Then you get to Act 6 which is a very highly intense act. That's where the peanut and the strawberry end up on the Juliet Balcony.

SUPERJUMP

Yeah, I remember that. Both of the main characters share the same level. Was it difficult to pull off?

Lorraine

Well, if you're asking me, the difficulty was teaching the peanut boy the lower part because he kept wanting to sing the tune. Because it's a harmony part, it's really hard. Really hard. And you know, they're tricky tunes for an 8-year-old and a 9-year-old. But they did it, and I want that to be known.

SUPERJUMP

It will certainly be known. And you'll probably get plenty of great comments about your job here!

Lorraine

I'm not after the praise. All I want everyone to know is that both of us worked really, really hard to get a beautiful artistic standard. For two people to create this amount of high-standard [art]? It has to be known that things aren't just thrown away in this society. And that people really care about their art – and we are the best. [laughs]

SUPERJUMP

You are the best! And, just so you know, I love your energy, Lorraine. You are such a character. It’s just good fun being around you.

Anyway, back to Philipp: were there any interesting gameplay ideas that you tried implementing but you couldn't figure out a way to make them work, and had to throw them away?

Philipp

Yes. I had to throw away a few ideas. In the beginning, I thought it would be a great idea that you could drag the whole world. So really – everything. But that just resulted in one big mess. No one knew what should happen if everything's in the wrong place in the end. This is something that just didn't work out.

Lorraine

Iggy, did you play the xylophone in the game?

SUPERJUMP

The xylophone? Oh, yes, yes! I even tried dragging my finger through the fingers of the xylophone. But that's not how my phone worked.

Lorraine

It's called a pentatonic scale. It actually goes along with the music. It's incredible how it all worked out because Philip came and showed me the xylophone and I said, ‘Oh God, I can make that work!’

Philipp

This was a bit beautiful, frustrating, and also a bit of a surprise to me. Because you see the xylophone at a section where the scale changes. And I wasn't aware that is even possible in music theory. At the beginning, I tried to find the notes myself and thought, ‘Okay, this sounds good with the music, but somehow it doesn't sound good with the music?’ I asked Lorraine if she could send me notes for the dynamic xylophone. She said, ‘That's because the harmony [of the background music] changes. Then also the xylophone has to change the notes or else it would just sound odd.

When you play the xylophone in the game, it always sounds good with the music. That’s because the notes of the xylophone also change with the music. But you don't notice that as a player.

SUPERJUMP

That is mind-blowing. Lorraine, before Philip approached you with this totally bonkers idea for a project, what was your understanding of video games as a creative medium?

Lorraine

I don't play games at all because my life is a game. My life is a video game actually. It's full of chances. It's full of opportunities. It's full of gateways. It's full of levers.

SUPERJUMP

So you have three lives?

Lorraine

What do you mean?

SUPERJUMP

Usually, video game characters have three lives. At least in classic video games, like Mario, Zelda and etc.

Lorraine

Maybe I have three lives. [laughs] I just never got into video games because my life as a musician, as a performer, is such a challenge. Why would I even wanna spend my spare time doing more challenges?

I'm quite old now, and it’s just a series of doors that open and then shut. Disappointments and great pieces of joy. And that's what happens in a video game.

SUPERJUMP

The final question, guys. And this goes for both of you: Is there a feature, a song, or a technical element that you are most proud of?

Philipp

I think the highlight of the game is Act 10, the finale. And this builds up musically. I think Lorraine would do a better job explaining how it builds up musically. But I made sure that it also builds up visually and gameplay-wise. When the toast enters the stomach of the king – everything changes. The scale changes, the gameplay changes, the visuals change. When the toast comes out from the butt of the King, it's just a whole new world as the Wizard of Oz would say. And presenting this in such a ridiculous way is really the thing that I’d call the highlight of PBJ.

SUPERJUMP

Love that answer. Lorraine, do you want to add something to that?

Lorraine

I just can't do favorites because I think it's all an amazing work of art. Each act is almost like a whole game on its own... I think that's a good thing to say in your interview. [laughs]

And you know, you get to Act 6 and you think, ‘I can't cope anymore!’ In fact, when Phil came in in December and showed me the game, I said [to him], 'Wow, after 30 minutes I need a break – a break from all this amazing intensity. Phew!' But I also love Act 7 – the music, I think it’s fantastic! Menu tonight. Menu toniiiight [singing] I love that.

But Act 10 is also amazing. It starts as a fanfare for the king. Then you hear the King burping, which I think is genius. The person who farted and burped had to keep doing it for three days before I got the best farting.

SUPERJUMP

Who did the farting?

Lorraine

I'm keeping quiet about that. But I had to feed them beans for three days... It's a good fart. And it's a darn good burp as well.

Stay tuned to SUPERJUMP for more interviews with creators, developers, and so many other personalities in the gaming space!